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Robert Lee

FAQ: Ba Zi (Lunar vs Xia), Timezone etc

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This Ba Zi FAQ has been created to answer some of the commonly asked questions on:-

  •  
  • Difference in Chinese Lunar vs Seasonal Calendar
  • Many different variations in Feng Shui Concepts
  • Whytwo mastershave the different intepretation
  • Difference in Ba Zi Birth Element (ie weak/strong element)
  • Some common variations in Ba Zi Concept
  • Special types of charts (Follow the Leader Chart)
  • Do I need to apply location or GMT time changes

Previously, resources on these questions were found on different postings. We have decided to combine all the resources into this single post so that you can read all the various questions commonly askedon the ba zi. This way, we do not need to individually reply to each and everyone.

CHINESE LUNAR CALENDAR AND SEASONAL CALENDAR

There is basically two different calendar that is used in Chinese Calendar System:-  

1) Chinese Lunar Calendar - This is used most commonly based on Moon rotation to the Earth. That is where you get the Full Moon etc. This is also commonly used as the defacto calendar format you see in most Chinese Calendar.  

2) Seasonal Calendar (Xia/H'sia Calendar or some call Chinese Solar Calendar) - This is used to determine theseasonal influence. So far used partially in the Ba Zi for seasonal influence analysis and any analysis that requires the seasonal influence.  

Example of the differences:-  

  • Chinese Lunar Calendar 2009 Year of the OX is from 26 Jan 2009 to 13 Feb 2010.
  • Seasonal Calendar 2009 Year of OX is from 4 Feb 2009 to 18 Feb 2010
 

Blind Period / Gray Period:-
The difference 16 Jan 2009 to 3 Feb 2009 where the Chinese Lunar Calendar vs Seasonal Calendar is often called the gray or blind period. This is where though the moon has passed, the season has not yet come into play.  

Both the Chinese Lunar and Seasonal Calendar areequally important calendars for the Chinese Calendar system. Only difference lies in one focus on the moon and another focus on the seasons. So there is you cannot say that one calendar is better than the other. They are each mant for different purpose. They are almost similiar except how they define the starting date of each month.

MANY CONCEPTS IN FENG SHUI

There are many feng shui/fortune telling related concepts:-  

1) Ba Zi (Pillars of Destiny or Four Pillars) - Is a luck forecast of a person's Heaven Luck  

2) Chinese Horoscope / Chinese Astrology (Zi Wei Dou Shu) - Which focus on horoscope and relationship analysis  

3) Compass School (Eight House & Flying Star)

a) Eight House is a personal Gua (Kua) system that gives some personalisation for the Compass School.  

b) Flying Star is an advanced compass school that basically is to determine the Earth Luck of a House. Something like a ba zi of a house. 

4) Fortune Telling related - I-Ching/Palmistry/Face Reading/Bone Reading even Ba Zi has some of this aspect. In any case, a combination of all these will give a good fortune telling reading.  

In any case, we are more focused on Feng Shui which is usually related to Ba Zi, Chinese Horoscope and Compass School which focuses on a person's luck and the relationship to the environment.

MANY VARIATIONS IN THE SAME CONCEPTS

In almost all concepts, there are numerous variations in concepts and techiques by many different masters depending on which concepts or calendar format he/she has learnt from. So much so that even the same concept, you will find different variations such masters using different calendar system.  

Even for masters with the same calendar system, they also each have some variation in how they interpret the analysis results. There are also varying degree of how accurate the analysis is done which also affects the results. This is why, for the same home, depending on all these factors, you can have 3 different masters with different interpretations. So unfortunately, this makes it even more confusing for a feng shui newbie.  

It is unfortunate, but this is bound to happen. The reasons is because of the different concepts and different calendar system adopted.  

So normally, it is best to with the master that you trust. It is unwise to seek bits of analysis from here and there and attempt to put it together yourself. As there are different variations, you won't know if they will work well together or not.

HOW DIFFERENT CALENDAR SYSTEM AFFECTS THE BA ZI CHART

Various variation of Ba Zi (Pillars of Destiny or Four Pillars) Analysis  

Generally, if you use a common calendar format for the entire ba zi chart, you cannot be faulted. This is because the analysis will be correct when you relate the different pillars in the same calendar format. Such as the year to the month pillar or the month to the day pillar.  

However, it will be wrong if two different calendar format are mixed and you try to relate the pillars together.  


A) Ba ZI WITH FULL CHINESE LUNAR CALENDAR

A ba zi chart done with Full Chinese Lunar Calendar will look like this:-

Chinese Lunar Calendar Ba Zi
Year: Ji-Chou (Ox) - (Lunar Calendar Year)
Month: Bing-Yin - (Lunar Calendar Month)
Day: Xin-Wei - (Lunar Calendar Day)


B) BA ZI WITH FULL SEASONAL CALENDAR (XIA/H'SIA)

A ba zi chart done with Full Seasonal Calendar will look like this:- 

Seasonal Calendar Ba Zi
Year: Wu-Zi (Rat) - (Seasonal Calendar Year)
Month: Yi-Chou - (Seasonal Calendar Month)
Day: Xin-Wei - (Seasonal Calendar Day) 


C) BA ZI WITH MIXED LUNAR & SEASONAL CALENDAR  

A ba zi chart done with mixed Lunar & Seasonal Calendar will look like this:- 

Mixed Lunar & Seasonal Ba Zi
Year: Ji-Chou (Ox) - (Lunar Calendar Year)
Month: Yi-Chou - (Seasonal Calendar Month)
Day: Xin-Wei - (Lunar Calendar Day) 


Basically, both a) Ba zi with Full Chinese Lunar Calendar or b) Ba Zi with Full Seasonal Calendar are both technically correct as they both will use one consistent calendar format for the full chart. c) Ba Zi with mixed lunar & seasonal Calendar is however INCORRECT. 

There are some websites which will generate the Ba zi with Mixed Lunar Calendar & Seasonal Calendar which is NOT correct. It is absolutely wrong to mixed the calendar format. This is like comparing an Apple to an Orange. How can you have a chart that is showing the day and year in Lunar calendar and month in Seasonal Calendar.

WHY DOES GEOMANCY.NET ADOPT THE BA ZI CHINESE LUNAR CALENDAR?

So if both a) Ba Zi Calendar with Full Ba Zi Calendar and b) Ba Zi Calendar with Full Seasonal Calendar is technically correct. So why is it Geomancy.Net adopted the Lunar Calendar vs the Seasonal Calendar?  

This is because you must understand that if you show a chart in the Seasonal Calendar, it actually greatly eases your need to calculate the next luck pillar, the seasons etc. As based on just the month or year, you can easily plot the chart out manually. We know personally how difficult it is to calculate a ba zi chart manually. Furthermore, this affects actually only a handful of people that falls in the Gray/Blind period. Otherwise, the chart is exactly identical.  

For a Ba Zi Chart done in Lunar Calendar, you need to calculate the seasons where necessary, and thus making it more time consuming to analyse or plot out other information. Just by looking at the Ba Zi chart that is shown in the Lunar Calendar. At Geomancy.Net, we have already programmed the complex ba zi calculation with the computer, so why should we go for the easy way out and miss out some of the advanced pillars of destiny concepts.


A) DIFFERENCE IN YEARLY HOROSCOPE

The main reasons is the difference in the Horoscope sign that you will have if you use a Seasonal Calendar. In the seasonal calendar, for those born in usually Dec/Jan/Feb may find that you may end up with your ba zi horoscope as Rat, whereas in the Chinese Horoscope or Chinese Calendar as Ox. So which horoscope sign to use if you are in such a situation? Are you a Ox or a Rat?  

For example:-  

  • Chinese Lunar Calendar 2009 Year of the OX is from 26 Jan 2009 to 13 Feb 2010.
  • Seasonal Calendar 2009 Year of OX is from 4 Feb 2009 to 18 Feb 2010
  • By using the Chinese Lunar Calendar Ba Zi, your Horoscope sign will be Ox once you cross 16 Jan 2009. This will be the same even when you use the Chinese Horoscope analysis.  
 

However, should you be using the Seasonal Calendar for the same date 16 Jan 2009. You will get a situation where your ba zi will say that you are a Rat, while your chinese horoscope considers you a Ox. So under this situation which horoscope compatibility do you apply? Are you a Rat or a Ox?  

The Chinese Horoscope has a lot of features about compatiblity and if this compatiblity analysis differs from the Ba zi horoscope, what to believe?  

This is one of the major problem that you will find if you use the Ba Zi Seasonal Calendar. By sticking to the Chinese Lunar Calendar, you won't have this conflict. As such, be it the ba zi or chinese horoscope you will be a Ox once you cross the 26 Jan 2009. 

B) ADVANCED PILLAR OF DESTINY ANALYSIS 

As we have learnt both the Chinese Lunar and Seasonal Calendar ba zi calculation. We found that when you do convert the chart to the Seasonal Ba Zi Chart, you will actually not be able to calculate a couple of advanced ba zi analysis. As that really depends on your actual Chinese Calendar month. The blind or gray period actually is necessary for such calculation. But this won't be possible if you use the Ba Zi Seasonal Calendar. 


C) LUCK FORECAST FOR A BA ZI LUNAR CHART ACTUALLY PROVIDED A MORE ACCURATE FORECAST FROM OUR EXTENSIVE TESTING  

Having done so many ba zi analysis, we find that the ba zi chart actually provided a more accurate forecast than one that is charted out from the Seasonal Calendar.  

This is because the ba zi lunar chart can be related to the chinese horoscope and many other concepts that is based on the lunar calendar.  

Ba Zi is only one of the many tools in feng shui / horoscope. It has it's strength and weakness. But if you are able to put together analysis from various reports, you actually cancel out each other's weakness and re-enforce the final intepretation.  

This is why we say that the ba zi lunar chart when put together with other concepts often allows us to better troubleshoot the source of the problems and thus able to apply the concepts more effectively. 

D)BA ZI LUNAR CHART CALCULATION IS ACTUALLY AVAILABLE BUT VERY FEW PEOPLE REALLY KNOWS ABOUT IT 

As most books available to teach Ba Zi books available on feng shui were written by Hong Kong Masters. Most Hong Kong Masters are applying the Ba ZiSeasonal Calendar.So most people who learn Ba Zi are basically learning and applying thisthis method of calculation.  

However, having more people using it simply because it can be easily learnt from books. Does not necessary mean that it is the only way or the best method available.  

In our case, we are able to chart both the Chinese Lunar and Seasonal Calendar Ba Zi. Which means we know the pros and cons of each of the concepts. But eventually choosen to use the Chinese Lunar Calendar over the Seasonal Calendar because of the a few critical issues we noted and that it missed out a lot of advanced analysis of the Ba Zi Lunar Chart.  

So we do not see why we should give users a less accurate analysis for the sake of convenience.

COMMON CALENDAR FORMAT IS EXTREMELY IMPORTANT

Our website uses Lunar Calendar as the standard Calendar format for all our website tools (ie ba zi, eight house, flying star etc). This allows all tools to properly work and re-enforce the analysis results.  

Your horoscope sign must be the same whether you use the Ba Zi or Chinese Horoscope, otherwise you will have problems trying to apply the cures or determine compatibility. By sticking to the Chinese Lunar Calendar, you won't have this conflict. As such, be it the ba zi or chinese horoscope you will be a Ox once you cross the 26 Jan 2009.  

Even Eight House or Flying Star is based on Chinese Lunar Calendar. So you again need to make sure you have a common frame of reference to be able to relate the different analysis together.  

For all our website tools, they will all work well with each other.  

As each tool specialise in one area of analysis, by combining all the strength of the results you can get a very comprehensive overview. For example, ba zi is good for your luck forecast and personal element. Chinese horsocope focus on the compatibilty. Eight House will cover the house suitability, while Flying Star will cover the earth luck.

DIFFERENCES IN TRUE BIRTH ELEMENT

This is not really due to the Calendar System. I have seen two masters using the same calendar format and still give you different results. So this is due more to the way the chart has been analysed to determine whether you are a weak or strong element.

In fact, this depends a lot on how accurately you:-

a) Check the seasons of birth which affects the five element seasonal strength.  

b) Check the combinations and clashes. These will affect again the final element and strength.  

c) Even analysis with or without the House of Life / House of Concept can affect the final element. 

After all the various checks are done, our website will tabluate a percentage value. By comparing the elements that makes you weak vs the element that makes you strong.  

Our website report will use thismathematically formula to determine whether you should be classified as weak or strong. We can clearly show users how we determine your element strength for our report.  

So if our analysis determined you are a weak element, it means elements that make you weak to you are less than elements that make you strong.  

Our free report isn't crippled in any way, so the result will be exactly the same as the paid report. Except that we do not show you this percentage breakdown. This percentage breakdown is key in applying feng shui effectively, as such it is reserved exclusively featurefor paid users of the ba zi report.  

Read more about an example of how we determine your element:-  

URL: http://forum.geomancy.net/phpforum/article.php?bid=2&fid=2&mid=22428&new=

 

SOME VARIATIONS IN BA ZI CONCEPT

 

A) DO WE NEED TO BREAK THE ZI (RAT) HOUR INTO EARLY / LATE RAT

There is no need for this. I had recently replied to a user on this. Please see this link for more information about why:-  

URL: http://forum.geomancy.net/phpforum/article.php?bid=2&fid=1&mid=23909

 

SPECIAL TYPES OF BA ZI CHART (I.E. FOLLOW THE LEADER CHART)

Actually, there is really nothing significantly different from the 'follow the leader' type of chart if you really know how to properly determine the weak/strong and apply the five element of balance properly.

Read more about this from this forum link which I had given a very clear example:-  

URL: http://forum.geomancy.net/phpforum/article.php?bid=2&fid=2&mid=20335&new=

 

APPLYING LOCATION FACTOR INTO BA ZI

1. Frankly, all the various practitioners/master who use TIME ZONE or LOCATION factors, are modern changes avocated by modern practitioners. There is no such calculation when Ba Zi was invented in China.  


2. The only method that is technically correct is to apply the LOCATION factor to the Chinese Lunar Calendar. Even this has two issues:-

a) Even 0.01 degree off either the latitude and/or longtitude, will make a major change to your ba zi chart. This 0.01 degree of error can make your chart even less accurate if it is incorrect. Which can be even less accurate than a chart that you leave the hour pillar as unknown.  

b) Most people don't even have the time of birth, let a lone the exact place of birth. So why complicate the issue. 

3. Using GMT time zone is a bad way to apply the location factor, because GMT timezone only affects the longtitude changes. Furthermore, GMT has been simplified so much so it is no longer as accurate as in the past.


4. Our stand on this issue is NOT to add these level of complication to the analysis. Meaning that you should just use your local time (regardless of what country), to analyse the ba zi.  

This is because if you truly understand how the ba zi works, the HOUR pillar will not make a major impact in terms of the 10-yearly, 5-yearly, yearly and monthly luck pillars.  

The hour pillar gives additional pillars available for combinations and clashes, so this can affect the final outcome of a person to be either weak or strong. A day without the hour will give the rough element strength of the day. Only a few hours may result in weak/strong element. Otherwise, not much change will occur. Your luck pillars will not be too badly influenced by the hour impact. Except for minor yearly and chart clash or harms that may occur. But these are minor as your general luck will not alter too much.  


5. This is why we can still analyse a person luck fairly well even if you do not provide the hour pillar. Just check out some of the masters who had done case study of famous people, you will noticed that they do it just with the date of birth. They don't even apply any location factor.  

Ba zi has designed to compensate from the lact of the hour pillar. So with or without the hour of birth, a person's chart can still be charted out. Just that with the hour pillar, your forecast will be more accurate.  


6. This is why we find no need to apply location into the bazi. Just use your local time and it should be ok.  


7. You must always remember that a ba zi is supposed to be a heavenly GIVEN chart of what kind of luck you are supposed to have assuming your environment remains constant. This means it does not consider education, your house (earth luck), people around you, your career etc.  

However, in real life, how can you expect your environment to be the same all the time. Your luck is always being altered by your house luck, people around you, and your career.  

Let me give you some example:-

a. Given a pair of twins with the exact date and time of birth. One has primary education and one has PHD. Which you think will have better life. Most likely the one with PHD.  

b. Given a same pair of twins. One stays in US and one stays in IRAQ. Which will you think will have a better life. Again most likely US as it is more stable and peaceful, as compared to a war torn country such as IRAQ.  

c. Given a two persons:-  

  •  
  • Person A has the 10-year luck favourable to him, but he stays in a house with entrapped feng shui and death suitability to the home.
  • Person B has the 10-year luck unfavourable to him, but he says in a house with excellent feng shui and prosperity suitability to the home.
 

The Person B will have actually a much better luck then person A. Cos, a person's earth luck has been ADVERSED impacted which superceeds his ba zi luck. 


8. So ba zi is NOT a tool which can forecast all past events with 100% accuracy. What it can do is give you a forecast of potential pitfalls allowing you to maximise your luck by avoiding the bad period. Many modern practitioners/masters, try to make you think that ba zi can give you an accurate assesment of your past and future events. How is this possible, if the concept is only supposed to provide you with a heavenly given luck?  


9. So our advice to you is just to leave the hour unknown or unaltered as it is NOT necessary.  

Read more from this link:-  

URL: http://forum.geomancy.net/phpforum/article.php?bid=2&fid=1&mid=16452&new=

 

GEOMANCY.NET'S REPORT HAS BEEN EXTENSIVELY TESTED & WILL WORK WELL TOGETHER

Our reports has been extensively tested and is based on concepts and practices that has been knownto produce good results from our experience.  

The reports are all using a common calendar format and thus will work effectively from one report to another.  

In fact, before we had released our tools on our website, we had carefully evaluated all the different concepts. For each concepts, we had carefully evaluated the pros and cons about the different variations available from different sources available. We had choosen the concepts that is most technically correct or from our experience has shown to work well for most people most of the time.  

So you can be assured that whatever concepts we use on our website has a reason behind it. And have done so, right from the launch of our website. However, previously we did not have the time to really explain clearly why we do so, as we had so many things to do.  

In fact, we have many clients whom had taken our services since we started and have beengrowing as our website.All these are further prove, that the concepts and tools on our website really do work wellwhen used together.  

It is best you apply the feng shui from awebsite or source that you trust if you are not sure. We do not advice you mixed our analysis with another website or source or vice versa. As there is no way to know whether the analysis is of the same calendar format or whether the same variations of the concepts.

Warmest Regards
Robert Lee
GEOMANCY.NET - Center for Applied Feng Shui Research

 

 

 

 

 

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Guest Chad

Thank you.. I do not Know Bazi , BUT I finally found my Lunar calendar birth date through your bazi calculator.. All i had was my western calendar date. It is accurate because it gave me the same date given by my parents years ago.. I thought I will never find it or have a chance to compare it to my western birth date. I always thought my western birth date was wrong due to war and errors..  But i typed it into you Bazi calculator and it gave me the Lunar Birth date and it is exactly what i was told by my parents years before...  Thanks again  , Thanks a million..  I never thought I would be able to calculate back in time to find the exact date, but your Bazi Calculator gave me the answer I was looking for all along. 

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A person bon between 11pm to 1am. Should I change my birth day?

For example, in this illustration, a person was born on 6th February between 11pm to 1am. Is this person born on 6th February or suppose to be 7th February?

 


Master Cecil Lee, Geomancy.Net

Master Cecil Lee, Geomancy.Net

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